Anonmon Wrote:As a rule, most supposedly scientific psychology should be taken with a shaker's worth of salt. It's all different ways of looking at the same thing without actually capturing the whole.
You'll never get science to prove such an obvious thing as free will, because science starts from the assumption that all things are mechanistic (running on rules like machines) or probabalistic (running on randomness like rolled dice). When you assume there is no free will, you eventually "discover" there is no free will.
Just live your life. So we're influenced by our parents! OF FUCKING COURSE! That doesn't mean, however, that we have no control over ourselves. We make choices, and we live with them.
Can you think of a better way to think?
That is actually a really, really good philosophy.
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UnknownH Wrote:Juvie is short for juvineile hall, the place where they send the really bad kids to go to school. Thanks.
Quote:Well Zeph, let's just say that we both think the other is a really great person, in a purely platonic way? Us complimenting each other back and forth is only going to start people talking!
*huge anime sweatdrop* Why are people such bad thinkers? I don't even think of our relationship as platonic; I just say what I think of you. Not every day I find sb I can honestly compliment, so I just say what I think when I do. And I'd be damned in hell before trying to pick up a guy that already has a girlfriend (no ethic matter, it's just I'm insanely jealous, and I try not to do things I would hate anybody doing them to me). In fact, the way you talk about your girlfriend is one of the things I like about you (while I hate the emotionless way Wise talks about that girl he supposedly likes).
So, if all this wasn't enough to convince all, I'll do this. *puts on a magical chastity belt that only works for senjuro* There.
Quote:Oh, I liked your comment about your mom taking stuff as seriously as boss battles...it's not every day you can make a video game analogy apply to real life as coherently as that.
LOL! Thank you ^_^
Quote:As a rule, most supposedly scientific psychology should be taken with a shaker's worth of salt. It's all different ways of looking at the same thing without actually capturing the whole.
You'll never get science to prove such an obvious thing as free will, because science starts from the assumption that all things are mechanistic (running on rules like machines) or probabalistic (running on randomness like rolled dice). When you assume there is no free will, you eventually "discover" there is no free will.
Just live your life. So we're influenced by our parents! OF FUCKING COURSE! That doesn't mean, however, that we have no control over ourselves. We make choices, and we live with them.
Can you think of a better way to think?
That's a totally unhealthy way of thinking, mainly cuz it's radically wrong. You're the kind of person that thinks that every act is an act of will, but you don't think what's behind your will. There IS a subconscious mind that manipulates each and every one of us from the shadows without us not even knowing it.
Whether you think you make choices, there's a voice in your head that guides those choices unconsciously.
To make myself clearer, I'll give a simple example, related to the above: think of a family that is very strict and controlling. Their children are either going to be strict and controlling, or the total opposite, that is, carefree and denying any kind of order or control. It's a 99% chance that their personality will become either of the two, but never a healthy balance where they can have enough both order and freedom. Do you think these children are 'free'? That their choices are conscious, an act of free will? I don't say we can't have free will, I just say most people don't have actual free will. According to Jung's psychology, they take the ego (the same) or the shadow (the opposite). They could have free will someday, but not before they take a long, hard look at their attitudes and realize what they're doing.
In my case, this thing is way more blatant: I had a controlling, authoritary, mean, selfish, heartless father that opressed both my mother and me. On the other hand, I had a nice, kind and giving grandfather who was my father during my first 3 years. So my mind is awfully writhing in pain btw these two opposites. I once have been told that if it wasn't for my grandpa, I'd be killing men in the streets right now.
Quote:Child of Our Time Quizes.
The ones toward the bottom are more helpful. The rest are about parenting
Thanks a lot. I'm gonna look at them now.
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senjuro Wrote:Well it just goes to show you how controlling some people can really be. Personally, I'm not a fan of exercising extreme control over other people. The more in check you try to keep something, the less control you end up having. Just look at uber-restrictive parents; their kids are usually in juvie by the time they're 16.
That's not entirely true. My mom was insane in her controlling and I didn't end up in juvie till 17.
"Stand tall and shake the heavens!" - Xenogears.
Parents: We could nearly always do without them.
To tell the truth Zephyr (and prove you at least partially wrong), I know exactly where my attitude comes from. My parents have been practical slaves to that "How to Raise Kids and Be Good" type of psychology since I was 4, and it's done me no end of suffering. So I reject that sort of thing as needing to be taken with a shaker of salt. However, I'm aware of why I have this attitude. The key to being really free-willed is knowing the very conscious reasons behind your feelings and decisions, rather than understanding some freaky sub-concious people get when their society won't let them think about sex (Frued reference. Jung was a Freudian).
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shadowknight Wrote:That's not entirely true. My mom was insane in her controlling and I didn't end up in juvie till 17.
Not all kids with pscyho parents end up with severe discipline problems, but a lot of kids with discipline problems have psycho parents.
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Anonmon Wrote:Parents: We could nearly always do without them.
To tell the truth Zephyr (and prove you at least partially wrong), I know exactly where my attitude comes from. My parents have been practical slaves to that "How to Raise Kids and Be Good" type of psychology since I was 4, and it's done me no end of suffering. So I reject that sort of thing as needing to be taken with a shaker of salt. However, I'm aware of why I have this attitude. The key to being really free-willed is knowing the very conscious reasons behind your feelings and decisions, rather than understanding some freaky sub-concious people get when their society won't let them think about sex (Frued reference. Jung was a Freudian). Sorry, but I don't know what "How to Raise Kids and Be Good" type of psychology is about. Could you be more specific?
And though I understand what you mean, it's still what I mean too. How can you tell the 'very conscious reasons'? Let's go with another example: We all want a mate here. It's not a life supporting need, in fact you can live all your life without having anyone, yet we all have the drive. It's just a trick that nature does to keep the species. Yet we feel empty if we don't follow it. We're not tied by need, but we are by....by what? By need too? Another kind of need? How many of us want to have kids right now? And yet that's the ultimate finality for mating.
And saying that Jung is a Freudian is like saying, though you might not like the comparison, like saying that Christians are Jews. Though Jesus was a Jew, He made a more modern, and therefore more open, enhanced and evolved type of religion (of course I am talking about what He did and not the shit His followers made up belatedly). Though Freud was the father of psychoanalysis, Jung discovered a continent where Freud just found some ruins (this I quoted from Freud. He said "Psychoanalysis is in its beginnings. Where I discovered a few ruins others can find a continent".)
And Herr, I did one of those quizzes. It's very interesting, the one that says how people perceive themselves. While the people my age are mainly focused in 'relationships', I'm most in 'inner' and also 'physical'. It's fun to think I'm so two-sided; like it explains there, young people tend to focus on physical while older people in inner. I guess I've been through so much that now my 'inner' is what counts the most, but I still have this worrying about my physical like young people. (To be less nice with myself, it shows how messed up my brain is).
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